Hedge Question(s)

[Willa]

In reference to my neighbour's fence atrocity thread, Phil suggested planting a Laurel hedge.

I have been giving this some serious consideration. I've been looking all over the internet, and from what I have read, Portugeuse Laurel is a good candidate. It grows densely (depending on how it is planted) and is a fast grower. The awful fence it needs to cover up is on the north side of my lot, but it gets baked in sun for 6+ hours a day. In theory, a happy Laurel could grow to the top of the wretched fence in 5 - 8 years.

I have also read that P.Laurel can get 12 meters tall - which is way too tall for my purposes, and that it needs some trimming to keep it a more narrow shape.

I really don't like cedar hedges, esp. the ones made from the conical cedars. I've noticed many cedar type hedges that get brown/rusty at the bottom, get thin, etc.

What are people's experience with tall privacy hedges ? I am in Southwestern Ontario - zone 6A or 6B I think ? Hot, humid summers but also potentially cold and very cold winters with big dumps of snow.

[phil]

How about a "green wall" ? where they are basically plants growing out from the side rather than down in the dirt. Maybe then its not a fence it's your garden and not subject to the fence height bylaw? - Ha!
It could then only be above the top of the fence you have, just poles where it is already blocked out and plants where you want privacy. make the plants show both sides, use your gas station lights as grow lights. It would have to be sturdy enough not to fall over, maybe plant flowers and vines or whatever grows well in that climate? two poles set two feet apart that meet in the middle at the top to form an A frame so it didn't need to be too extreme to be strong, maybe even moveable? Picture the stand for a kids swing set, but with the feet closer and the top as high as necessary. maybe a bit of cement just around the feet so it cant' topple from wind. use something like conduit maybe 2 or 3 inches diameter for the poles or for extreme strength use steel pipe.

you can look up "green wall" and probably find more, but just as an idea
https://livewall.com/products/outdoor/

from the street it would be pretty obvious why it is there. I bet no one would bother you about it. Just have a welder make up the A's. The welder know how to make it so it's collapsible for transport and strong enough to not be a danger. If you wanted to get technical you could get an engineers approval for the design of it and a permit , or you could just go for it and beg forgiveness if you do get a complaint. then you aren't waiting for bushes to grow up.

[Willa]

There is no way that shoddy fence atrocity could support a green wall. The fence is not even worth painting as the "construction" is unsound.

I tried planting ivy but the cement retaining wall plus the northwest exposure was too hot/bright for it to thrive.

No local Portuguese Laurel to be found. I am now leaning towards Caragana - which grows tall and is extremely hardy with little care, and is inexpensive. Common Lilac might be a pleasant solution. I am less concerned about blocking out the cement retaining wall. It is the terrible fence's appearance built on top of it that makes me bonkers.

I need a hedge type planting that will also help to muffle the sound and obscure the light.

By everything that I've read whatever I'll be planting will take about 5 - 10 years to attain the height I need.

I read about bamboo - which has to be selected carefully for the right type - and is a fast grower. It's also pretty expensive. Some types are runners that have to be contained 36" below the soil level if it isn't wanted to invade the entire garden (too much trouble).

[Manalto]

Willa, sorry I've been out of touch and didn't answer your question about watering the tree in front of your house. You are right to want to wean it off artificial watering but at this point if you get several hot days in a row without rain, it will relieve stress by giving a good soaking. You only have to do that once or twice a week in very hot dry weather.

As far as a hedge, I would recommend Prunus laurocerasus 'Schipkaensis' or skip laurel as they're known in the trade. It's evergreen which I would want in a screening situation.

[KenN]

Have you looked at privet or Leyland Cyprus? I am in zone 7a and both grow very fast here.

The leyland Cyprus you can top them and shape them into more of a hedge then a tree.

Privet will drop it’s leaves in the real cold weather, so it is not an evergreen.

[phil]

There is no way that shoddy fence atrocity could support a green wall. The fence is not even worth painting as the "construction" is unsound.

a green wall would not ave to be any part of the cement wall or the fence, it could stand on the ground be about 2 or 3 feet wide and shaped like a sawhorse, only as tall as you like so long as the base is anchored.

you would have two sides. the containers could be racked between those two side supports and you could grow all sorts of things in there which wouldn't need to grow tall to have an effect. usually the concept is for the plants to hide the containers completely.

my thought was to build the simple structure from iron pipe , then the trays with the plants might be wider near the base and taper to thinner ones on top but you could make plywood shelves and use whatever pots you like. If it needed ballast to keep the weight down low to prevent tipping you might put cement blocks down near the base, maybe lighter stuff on top like pots with some potting soil and vermicultite so it wan't too top heavy. If you unload it you could move it where you like. Id leave the legs about a foot longer than the base so it could be dug in a little or cementing in the feet could be an option for safety. you;d just have to pay attention to the center of gravity and keep some weight low so the wind couldn't topple it .

I put two pot plants in big pots out in my garden since its legal. I had them on the porch until It crowded the porch. one is as tall as I am ( in it's pot still) the other isnt' far behind. they look lovely If you want height sunflowers grow tall so does corn but you want something that stays green in winter I think. a giant pyramid of pot might attract a little attention LOL! I'm waiting to see what the weather does. they will flower if the hours get shorter otherwise they might have to come inside to finish flowering. I put them inside in the dark for overnight to try to shock them into flowering but I dont think they liked that. they took a week or so to look happy again.

my yard is a mess as Im focusing all my strenght to my roofing. god it's a lot of work.

You could start something in oil drums, they would be 4 feet tall when started and then you wouldst' have to wait so long, maybe cut them open and transfer them down into to dirt later down the road.
a lot of people seem to be using these little piped in water systems that drip and quirt. they arent restricted under the watering restrictions. I tried turning my lawn to clover. Its doing well but so are all the weeds and tall grass that got in there. I dont want to cut the clover so Im just yanking weeds and doing a little selective weed whacking to try to stop the tall grasses from getting in there. Its's about 3/4 ok but some has other plants. If I can get just the clover Ill be happy. It stays a lot greened and it can take a little drought without going all brown like the lawn. the clover seems to stop at about 8 inches tall or so rather than growing up to your knees and becoming an eyesore like grass. I figure if I can get the clover happy I can always start turning sods over and moving plugs around to distribute it better. I like it better than grass but it seems there is still a little learning curve to looking after it. the first year I mowed it and it doidn't like being mowed too much. at one time it was the norm to have green perfect lawns and water them like crazy and use fertilizers and weed n feed... now I'm trying to get it it more natural. a couple of my neighbors spread some seeds that are just a variety of wildflowers, they look nice from a distance but quite tall for areas you walk in a lot. I'm hoping to set up a water timer then I can probably cut the clover to about 4" or so and it'll look a bit less wild. for now it can do what it wants because the roof has to get completed. If nothing else i'm getting stronger from so many trips up the ladder and dangling on a rope carrying stuff.
i planted rosemary, thyme and sage. they do ok , I think I do better growing weeds. did I tell you about my dandelions? I think we should have a contest on the forum for the best dandelions

Im getting lots of blueberries. the racoons love them too. my plums look a little small but they are turning yellow now so maybe they will be yummy anyway. that tree is ready to die from old age but it has a big sucker so I'm thinking I can hack the sucker off and it might grow and flourish and replace the old tree. I figure late september might be a better time to do that tnan now since its hot and dry.
I did that with another variety of plumb and even hacked every single branch off it about a year ago. now it must be 20 feet tall and 20 feet wide. it makes little plumbs that look like cherry tomatoes. my neighbor has an apple tree that is starting to shade my house I dont mind so much I'll clean the gutters, it blocks some traffic noise. I tried one I think it's a granny smith. bit tart probably good for pies.

I keep thinking of planing something tall along the front of my lot. i dont want huge trees but to block the trffic would be nice. I thought maybe a row of sunflowers or corn or both might be ok . It'll die off in winter but would look neat during the summer and give a little more privacy. my front lawn isnt very deep so I don't really want big huge bushes. I have lots of lilacs but they seem tame enough, the spread suckers but they dont seem to get into too much trouble with the roots. one is in front of my bay window so it helps a little. more trees less traffic noise, but I cant' win that battle, just tame the noisy cars a tiny bit.

[mjt]

I read about bamboo - which has to be selected carefully for the right type - and is a fast grower. It's also pretty expensive. Some types are runners that have to be contained 36" below the soil level if it isn't wanted to invade the entire garden (too much trouble).

How much maintenance do you want to do on the hedge? Choose carefully and avoid invasive species.

If you want the screening properties throughout the winter, you don't want a deciduous plant.

[Willa]

I would really like something that doesn't need pruning or shaping.

The noise(s) from the gas station neighbour particularly bother me in the summer when my windows are open, and when I'm in the yard. The light intrusion is also a constant issue. Yet this city does not have a light pollution bylaw !

I am in the process of covering up my side of their hideous fence which helps a lot, psychologically.

I am still leaning towards lilac, which is pleasant to look at and long lived, followed by caragana.

[Gothichome]

Willa, be aware that lilac can get unruly if left, it will need to pruned back for width.

[Willa]

Willa, be aware that lilac can get unruly if left, it will need to pruned back for width.

I'm okay with the unruly thing. I've been observing neglected lilacs in yards where not much seems to happen in the way of gardening, and they seem to get taller and thinner at the bottom but have a finite area they occupy dimensionally.

One side would be somewhat contained by the awful fence until it grows taller than the fence. The other side would spread into the flower bed area, which has room to spare.

I am just not the type for a manicured hedge that has to be carefully trimmed into a controlled shape several times a year. I like yards that look sort of overgrown and spinster cottage-y.

I was asking myself again why a vine wasn't a good solution which came back to I need something that will be taller than the fence to block out the incredible amount of light at night. I strategically planted a wild crabapple tree and an American Plum to block out the worst areas but realized I need more density.

Frankly the ideal solution would be for the gas station to erect a 10' opaque and structurally sound fence on their side, one with noise blocking properties, but that ain't gonna happen. Or the gas station could stop selling gas which would solve 90% of my issues, they could take down the canopy with the glaring light and remove the underground storage tanks and just be a 24 hr convenience store. Plus pay for a hedge worth of plants on my side to help block the sound of customers and their car stereos.