The stupid kitchen thing, restoration

[kelt65]

another contender might be a cork floor?

you could lay a new floor using reclaimed wood. I restored my floor and got it perfect with most cracks filled and poly'd I like the look of it but honestly, I keep it covered because I hate to wreck it up with chairs and by dropping things and denting it. I found some rubber stuff that clicks together for the work areas, but it is just temporary and I'd lke to find something suitable to protect the work area by the counter and the kitchen table area. Or change kitchen chairs to ones that don't have old porcelain wheels.

If I had to start from scratch I think I'd look into cork, or battleship lyno or maybe a reclaimed oak floor but more like the floor in a pub, in other words a distressed floor that you don't care about banging up, rather than something too highly finished. You could see what kind of T and G wood is available at your local old house parts place, see what options you have before laying plywood.

If you are going to reno that kitchen and you can do the flooring with cabinets out you won't be sorry, then if you want to ever change anything you don't have any limitations because the floor is everywhere.

You could consider ceramic tile, not my thing but lots of people seem to use the floor heating systems under that. If you get smooth stuff it might be sippery. The thing i hate about tile is the grout gathers dirt.

one neat option to plan into your kitchen is a hole in the cabinet baseboard with a foot switch that turns on a central vac, then you can sweep the dust right into the vacuum pickup and you don't need to use a dustpan.

I'm thinking lino, cork or unfinished (so I can finish myself) engineered wood (it's actually more stable than hardwood and does not gap). I'm heavily leaning towards cork at the moment; reclaimed wood is very expensive and not worth it in the kitchen to me. Fortunately I have a lot of time to make up my mind. One thing I like about linoleum over tile is that they let linoleum alone. Every ceramic or porcelain tile I look at has stone ink jet printed on it. I think that looks just cheap and atrocious. Plain, single color tiles look so much better. I imagine it's also difficult to get installers to do anything but a square grid, which also looks horrible. All the cabinets and counters are coming out, the only counter I'll have is the one the sink goes in and an island.

I like your vaccum idea a lot!

[Jeepnstein]

We have cork in our butlers pantry. It's wonderful stuff. Give it serious consideration.

[phil]

I have some grey vinyl I'm planning to use out on our semi covered front porch. Its thick heavy stuff, must have been from a industral building or something. I am sure it would stand up quite well similar to the Jute backing stuff, maybe more dimensionally stable. I think if I glue it down to fresh plywood it will be a lot tougher than the stuff they usually use for decks. I just put some of that decking stuff in my van, it is very thin with a fiberous backing. I think a 12 foot piece 6' wide was about 120.00 at Home Despair , plus a gallon of contact cement.

with my kitchen floor because it had the Jute backing stuff originally it had rusty nails I guess that backing is a path for any leaks to get into with no real way out. I bet modern industrial vinyl is every bit as tough.

[phil]

I mentioned this before and no one responded , but one other consideration is a paper floor. that's right! just craft paper. and glue. You can read up on the techniques and see some of the pictures. Basically you just lay paper and then glue and the glue is the floor. But there are some really interesting techniques that come from that , sich as tearing the paper or crumpling it or using printed patterns. Mark the floor up, well you just lay a bit more paper more glue and you are good to go it sounds like a nutty idea until you look into it and see some of the images. I think this is a really interesting technique and it doesn't get any cheaper !

gheck out some google images just to see some of the floors, it can easily look like cork or be much fancier

https://www.google.ca/search?q=paper+fl ... iAodF7oN-w

Phil

[Powermuffin]

Oh Phil, I think future owners might despair over this paper floor technique! Even though I love my Marmoleum Click (and we have had water leaking on it, with no damage), I still prefer a wood floor. Every type of floor has its issues; I guess it comes down to personal preference, but at least with ours, it is easy to undo.
Diane

[Bungalove]

Another vote for Marmoleum brand of real lino. We installed the click type in our entryway closet and it replaced the old sheet lino that we found when we ripped out the hideous carpet. Sadly, the old lino was beyond saving but the new lino we got almost matched it in color and pattern (Van Gogh color, seen here: http://www.forbo.com/flooring/en-gl/pro ... eal/bftg77). It feels wonderful although, being in a closet, we don't walk back and forth across it.

As you are probably finding, 99% of the people in home improvement stores have NO IDEA what real linoleum is or ever was. All they know is vinyl, which I loathe.

[phil]

I think the paper technique could be done over a material that is removable. I haven't seen the Marmoleum click up close and in person but when I saw the videos of them laying it ,I just got the impression it was just like a laminate floor but with a cork finish rather than that fake repeating wood like pattern that we all love so much I wouldn't hesitate to lay Laminate in particular if you have a large amount to restore and you want a place liveable without damaging the original floor. You can clean up a bedroom in a day for example and if you want tear that up five years in and still refinish the floor.
In mine I went to huge lengths to save the floor which was not only scattered with rusty nails and black marks but had a layer of tar like stuff that nothing would dissolve and I spent hundreds of hours getting that off with a clothes iron, water bottle and scraper, then sanded and pieced in all the parts that were plywood with reclaimed.about 1/3 of the floor. The end result looks splendid but after all that work my heart sinks when I just drop a can of soup and it dents the floor. with your marmoleum it would take a hit like that.

My dad said that with CMHC which was the canadian mortgage and housing corporation.. they specified standards lke insulation etc etc.. here in Canada. you could get a loan more easily if the building was built to these building standards,, anyway He said they wouldn't allow wood floors in kitchens for hygienic reasons they can't be cleaned as well. They look nice and it depends on the kitchen. I have seen oak floors with rubust oak furniture that looked amazing and comfortable. Most modern kitchens like the ones in new condos are always a selling feature and they go all stainless open concept stone counters and the buyers all go woo, but it is a trend, whereas most of us are striving to keep some originality. Original kitchens aren't that exciting or easy for modern life. We have way more appliances so we need more counterspace and plugs. to meet code about half of my 200 amp panel is just for kitchen plugs. the old panel wouldn't even have enough breakers for the kitchen every outlet needs to be on its own breaker and there are rules about how far apart they can be. I put lots. the uppers were always really low and now they are higher usually with more room for blenders and microwaves and stuff. Now we want a dishwasher and those old free standing cabinets are nice to look at but don't offer the same amount of space that we have grown accustomed to. we want our houses to be liveable so the kitchen is one area where it can be hard to say I want it all original. I think we can admire ones that are but most homes have updated kitchens. I put a good blower in not just fan that recycles smoke through a cheesy filter, I love that. to meet code it needs a n air inlet so it can't backdraft the furnace but my house is so leaky that wasn't an issue. Its all about what you want. The OP just wants to lay something simple easy to clean uncomplicated and isn't into going to the work and expense of buying recycled flooring then laying sanding finishing it is a lot of work and upsetting the kitchen too much has cost a lot of marriages.. its one room that is not easy to live without, you need a sink and a toilet, going for more than a day without one is difficult at best. so I can totally see why someone would want to do a quick fix , to live. My ex wife wanted an island which just couldn't fit the space and still have a table. I hate stools.yea it was a point of contention and I worked so had to restore, looking back yea a quick fix was probably a smart plan, but hindsight is 20/20. I was just more into restoring an old house than she was and that's ok now.

I don't know if I'd do one of those paper floors in a kitchen but I think the concept is fascinating and some of the ones I see on the images are amazing. It would be fun to try to do one over a laminate floor just to play with the idea and see how it works out. It does really lend itself to being customized and the price is awesome. That wood glue is only about 18 bucks a gallon. one could do something like a commercial floor and use a machine and products like they use in stores and hospitals to make a really impervious floor. the paper is just what you see underneath the clear finish.

I don't think it is wrong to want a more modern kitchen in an old house, we live a lot differently that they did then. the kitchen used to be a work area , now I put a couch and loveseat in mine and the table and when people visit we use it more like the family room. it fits for me. It started because I want to reno the living room but I need time. if I had a bunch of kids maybe it wouldn't work but I find when I use the living room as intended, well you can scream and no one in the other room can hear you so it creates a very divided space, good in some ways bad in others. I'm not moving walls to make it an open concept new style house. It is what it is just a comfortable bungalow with no dining room. It never had one and I think if it did I would just get tired of carrying stuff back and forth. Its different if you like to put on dinners for a dozen people.

[kelt65]

I don't think it is wrong to want a more modern kitchen in an old house, we live a lot differently that they did then. the kitchen used to be a work area , now I put a couch and loveseat in mine and the table and when people visit we use it more like the family room. it fits for me. It started because I want to reno the living room but I need time. if I had a bunch of kids maybe it wouldn't work but I find when I use the living room as intended, well you can scream and no one in the other room can hear you so it creates a very divided space, good in some ways bad in others. I'm not moving walls to make it an open concept new style house. It is what it is just a comfortable bungalow with no dining room. It never had one and I think if it did I would just get tired of carrying stuff back and forth. Its different if you like to put on dinners for a dozen people.

Oh, I don't want a kitchen museum, mind you, I just dislike this silly trend of luxury kitchens and bathrooms, at the expense of the rest of the house, usually. I just feel the kitchen should be designed with one goal in mind: facilitating kitchen work. That means, 1) appliances close together 2) being able to pivot from counter to sink or stove without walking across the room 3) chopping area away from stove but nearby 4)EASY TO CLEAN

All this can be accomplished with inexpensive materials. I think expsnsive stone countertops are absurd - they're too hard, make a lot of noise, amplify whatever noise there is, and are too glitzy and glossy for a kitchen. I swear Americans are so gullible about these things, they will jump on these dumb trends and spend their entire retirement savings on them. I wonder if the "granite counter / spa bathroom people", were they ever to set foot in an Italian Baroque palace, would wonder why the Italians used to put the bathrooms in the front of the house. And then go home and do that, since it is so classy.

Below: A stunning Italian bathroom! GORGEOUS!

[img=center]https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/e8/ca/df/e8cadf346c5dc02b6a45e441bfee5cd8.jpg[/img]

[bfarwell]

I'm a general opponent of "stainless steel appliances/granite countertops" and all that that realtor ad copy represents, but I think the stone countertop in general does have some 'easy to clean' and 'can sit a hot pan on it' things in its favor...along with it being a decent worksurface for rolling out dough or making pasta.

Wood ones are pretty but not terribly sanitary, and tile counters are a nightmare to use/clean. Our plastic laminate countertop keeps me paranoid about either gouging it with a knife or scorching it with a pot (though it's fine for rolling dough). I'd be quite happy with a stone one as long as it wasn't ghastly to look at.

I also think there's something to be said for opening up the kitchen so they connect more with the living space; at dinner parties we're always hiding in the kitchen half the time, and it would be nice to have the ability to communicate with the rest of the guests.

[Don M]

I'm a general opponent of "stainless steel appliances/granite countertops" and all that that realtor ad copy represents, but I think the stone countertop in general does have some 'easy to clean' and 'can sit a hot pan on it' things in its favor...along with it being a decent worksurface for rolling out dough or making pasta.

Wood ones are pretty but not terribly sanitary, and tile counters are a nightmare to use/clean. Our plastic laminate countertop keeps me paranoid about either gouging it with a knife or scorching it with a pot (though it's fine for rolling dough). I'd be quite happy with a stone one as long as it wasn't ghastly to look at.

I also think there's something to be said for opening up the kitchen so they connect more with the living space; at dinner parties we're always hiding in the kitchen half the time, and it would be nice to have the ability to communicate with the rest of the guests.

Yes, we have nice Formica type counters with wood edging that matches our custom pine cabinets in our small kitchen in our 1830s farm house. It is separated from the formal dining room & the family (former farm kitchen) room.

We have fairly plain brown (with tiny gold flecks) granite counters in our 1999 SC modular home. It's a large room with a nice dining space which opens into the large living-dining room.

Both spaces are nice and fit the type of houses we have. It seems that the builders & house flippers want to remove as many walls as possible & open up the entire living space which is extreme in my opinion.