No original windows - what to do?

[MillworkersCottage]

Hi everyone! Our 1905 cottage had all it's windows replaced in the 70's or 80's with aluminum framed double pane windows. The seals have cracked, the windows have fogged, and they are cold and drafty. What is the best course of action here? Do we just replace them with modern wood frame windows, or is it possible to slowly salvage, restore and replace them with old windows? What would you do?

[Willa]

Hi. Welcome to the HD.

Hmm, the windows are a dilemma. If it was me, I would search Craigslist, ReStores, etc. for antique windows that are the correct size. Old wood sash windows can be reglazed, have the joints tightened up, and be otherwise fixed. There are also many that are in great shape that just need a fresh coat of paint. If you are lucky, your windows will be a common size. You may be missing window parts like the sash weights (though my 1898 house has original windows with no weights at all) and the pulley hardware.

BUT - I discovered that my house seems to have unusual window dimensions as I have spent many, many hours looking for antique storm windows to fit my otherwise normal appearing original windows.

I guess it depends on your budget and sense of urgency. There are some members who have had bad replacement windows replaced with much better new wood sash windows that match what would have originally been there. Getting all the windows replaced in a house can be a big ticket expense.

With an old house you have to pick your battles.

[1918ColonialRevival]

Another option would be to have some wooden windows made at a local millwork shop. If your openings are of unusual sizes, this may be your best option. I'd probably start with the ones on the front of the house.

[phil]

you could contact a joiner ( cabinetmaker) and get estimates.
You could buy yourself a tablesaw, a jointer and a router. Myself I'd buy used machienry then make them myself by copying original windows.

I would make a test piece first of softwood to get the method down then make them from reclaimed lumber or new but tight grained fir.

you may need to buy knives for your router to cut the mating window profiles or this can be accomplished on other equipment if you have access. It can be done with only a tablesaw If you are not set on fancy profiles.

If I were to make them I'd try to do as many as I could in sequence, this is because there are many steps and you'll get greater uniformity and obtain higher speed if you do multiples of each operation rather than making each a one off.

I'd start by obtaining , acclimatizing and roughing out the lumber for squareness and flatness, then start cutting the pieces to their basic size. when you have nice straight liumber and enough to do all of what you need, then I would begin the process of cutting the profiles. Its a lot of repetition, and accuracy is important so you dont want wood that is not well acclimatized or your windows can warp after they are built.

you might use reclaimed joist, old doors or whatever you can find that is old and has enough dimension to be re-used. I usually prefer this and then I dont have to pay for any wood.

Personally Id prefer to put the money into the machines and tooling needed than to hire it out but it depends how much you like woodworking. of course you can spend money and have others do it for you if that' fits your needs better.


there are window manufacturers that can do it for you if you prefer that.

finding old windows to fit your holes might be a challenge but no harm in trying. you may find that they also removed the window frames and sills and they may not come with the windows.
there are cabinet saws, usually heavy and not portable and accurate, or there are contractor saws which are easy to transport but not very accurate. you can do a lot on a contractor saw. Id make that distinction if you shop for a used saw. The style of fence and how it locks is important and if you compare how robust the trunnions are, this is a good indication of how sturdy is , thus how accurate. a contractor saw wont' have a super heavy table, those saws serve a different purpose although you can push limits , its more comfortable to use a cabinet saw for this type of work than a contractor's portable saw. the word tablesaw is often not specific.

I htink you can find a good older tablesaw, a router and about a 6 or 8 inch jointer all used for under $1000 , but it might take a bit of looking. used equipment auctions are probably a good place to look but be careful you dont buy stuff that is 3 phase unless you are prepared to convert the motor or modify the electrical. I'ts possible to run 3 phase with an added phase convertor or some electronic circuitry but best to buy 110 or 220 single phase for home use.

If I buy equipment Im never sorry , then I can use it many times and the experience is valuable to me. That's not the answer for everyone else, but that's how I see it. I'd overbuy a bit on the lumber, allow for some boo boos along the way, some errors are matter of course. There is lots about the different ways to approach it on U tube. If you even just watch a few it will give you a bit of info to use in your planning even if you hire it out. The process will vary with the equipment you have access to.

[Gothichome]

Millwork, I think I would be inclined to replace with a good quality wood sashes. I never really liked the sealed inert gas filled double panes. They are destined to fail every time. If your up to putting storms up every season, then simple glass sashes will work. Some of the modern better quality manufactured window would be a good choice with no storms. But they are expensive.

[JacquieJet]

Hoffmeyer's Mill makes beautiful wood sash windows, but of course cost reflects quality.
I'd be inclined to try to make wood sash windows work, personally. I'm not sure if you could find salvaged ones that would fit, but looking never hurt anyone! Try kijiji/craigslist, salvage yards, etc, and see what you come up with.

[A.Fox]

When the preservation firm I worked for in DC renovated their office in a capitol hill row house, the house was in pretty poor shape, and they made the decision at the time to scrap the old windows and put in new wood sash windows. 20 years later they were having issues with the new windows prematurely rotting. The owners said if they could do it again they would have consolidated the salvageable parts of the original windows to the front and installed aluminum clad wood windows in the back. They were similarly of the opinion that if codes didn't require insulated glazing in new windows, they would much rather have single glazing and storms.

It may very well have been the particular window, but it is worth noting that the species and quality of the wood is imperative to the longevity of new windows. Some of this is tied to the difference between old growth and new growth wood. I've had reproduction wood windows added where they were missing in some of my recent jobs, but these have only been within the last 5 years. I'd be interested in if anyone else has experience with new wood windows and how they have held up.

[Wackyshack]

A storm this past Monday compromised an already wonky window in my house.
I am in the same situation as the original poster.
I don't have any original windows in the house, the flipper put in the cheapest vinyl possible and some have started to fall apart within 8 years of my living here.

I too need to find a place that makes wood replacements.
I had found BROSCO who makes true divided light wood windows, but I don't know if anyone has ever used them or not.
I have looked at the major players and wood windows. Andersen make ones that are clad with vinyl on the outside and for me that is not attractive. The windows will be up on the second story, hard to reach so I have entertained alum. clad...If you think I am insane, please talk me out of it.
I have found there are so many components to each of the major retailers: Marvin, Jeld-wen, Andersen that I think my brain is going to explode.
I remember Jade wasn't all that impressed with the big window makers, and her observations have always stayed with me as I searched for windows.

I need help here and a reset. I had asked over a year ago about windows when I was confronted with the same confusion, but another old house issue lured me away from it. Now since I have yet another window that is barely able to lock shut and the bottom sash comes out of the track into your hands, I think I better use my tax return to get a window. The other hurdle to jump will be finding someone willing to come over to the house with essential workers risking outside infection being brought onto the premise. Hey the fun never ends at the Wackyshack.

To answer A. FOX.
I did have a contractor install an wood replacement Andersen window into our bathroom and one of the back bedrooms. So far there have been zero problems, or complications from them. They have been installed 10 years ago.
I had two 7ft picture windows installed (also Andersen wood replacement) that are 13 years old and I have had no issues at all with them.

[GinaC]

Today VT's governor started lifting the lockdown a bit and is now allowing a team of two workers for jobs on properties. I don't know where the Wackyshack is, but maybe you won't be waiting as long as you think. Businesses are probably chomping at the bit to get back to work again.

I've been so stressed out by the whole situation that I haven't even touched any projects around my house in awhile.

[Gothichome]

Wackyshack, I posted my thoughts on the Facebook site. Gina, I usually don’t like to comment on other people’s politics but lifting covid controls at this point is asking for disaster.