Hi from Western KY!

Introduce yourself here, tell us about your house and interests. Share some pictures.
parkavenue79
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by parkavenue79 »

GinaC wrote:I am seriously drooling over your original details! You have quite a lot to work with!

I believe that second floor room is a Sleeping Porch. I think they were usually enclosed?


Thanks! I do have a lot to work with....and a lot of work to do. I pretty much bought the house because I was tired of seeing homes around the area torn down and wanted to make sure it didn't happen to this one.

I've went back and forth on the porch. It is poorly constructed and I figured it might have originally been more of an open-air porch. But, it is one of the uglier parts of the house and it going to be the only big change I make. I'm more upset that half the house lost it's original tile roof. :angry-banghead: :angry-steamingears:

1918ColonialRevival
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by 1918ColonialRevival »

Welcome! As others have mentioned, your house has a ton of potential and you are very fortunate to have so many original details intact.

I'll go a little more in depth on the styling. The overall style is a Craftsman bungalow, as has already been pointed out, but it also has secondary elements of Spanish Revival (the clay tile roof) and Tudor Revival (the half-timber on the exterior). Starting around the 1890s, architects and builders started to get creative with their designs and began constructing houses and buildings that didn't fall into one particular category of architecture. The first quarter of the 20th Century is my favorite for designs, as you tend to see a little bit of everything.

Based on what I'm seeing, I would say your house was built between 1910 and 1920 without any additional information. To narrow it down a little more, I would say it's probably closer to the middle of the decade. It was likely relatively new when the 1918 mark was made on the wall.

Are you doing most of the work yourself? The reason I ask is pretty much everything I'm seeing can be saved. Some of it will take a little work. All too often, contractors will want to tear out original light fixtures, plumbing fixtures, wood trim, plaster, etc. Be selective with who you work with.

One final thing I wanted to mention was your door hardware. I forget the name of the design, but that particular door plate was in production throughout the 1910s and 1920s, so if you are missing any, they shouldn't be very tough to find and should be inexpensive.

By the way - I would have hit that dirt underneath the door with a metal detector. Many a coin has been lost by people digging for their keys. I've found quite a bit of silver and other interesting artifacts in similar areas around my house.

1918ColonialRevival
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by 1918ColonialRevival »

Also - forgot to mention, that tin ceiling should be saveable with some sanding and a couple of coats of good metal primer.

Regarding the sink in the basement. Standard (which merged with the American Radiator Company in 1929 to become the American-Standard that is still around today) introduced plumbing fixtures in various colors in 1927. I don't recognize this color as being one of their offerings around that period, so it may have been painted somewhere along the way. The color reminds me of the so-called "robin's egg blue" that was popular in the late 1950s. The styling of the sink is more 1910s-1930s. There may be a casting date on the bottom of the sink.

Kitchens in houses of this period were usually very small rooms that people other than the maid seldom ventured into. It also was somewhat common to have a second kitchen in the basement that was used for home canning or for special events that called for more cooking capacity than the main kitchen was able to accommodate. Our house had a second kitchen in the basement when we first bought it. We have pictures of both kitchens in full use when the previous owner's daughter was married in the house in 1954. There was also a small kitchen area in the finished attic, which was originally designed to be a maid's quarters. This would have been for the maid's personal use.

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Willa
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by Willa »

1918ColonialRevival wrote:ent. Standard (which merged with the American Radiator Company in 1929 to become the American-Standard that is still around today) introduced plumbing fixtures in various colors in 1927. I don't recognize this color as being one of their offerings around that period, so it may have been painted somewhere along the way. The color reminds me of the so-called "robin's egg blue" that was popular in the late 1950s. The styling of the sink is more 1910s-1930s. There may be a casting date on the bottom of the sink.



There were colored kitchen sinks as far back as the early 20's. They were uncommon - which is why they are so desirable today. Here's a story about an antique sink dealer in Mass. There are several unusual early drainboard sinks in the photos, including an "orchid" one. I strongly doubt that the green sink in the house was painted or refinished, judging by the very original state of the house.

https://retrorenovation.com/2018/04/24/150-vintage-drainboard-kitchen-sinks-original-finish-in-stock-at-all-times-massachusetts-motherlode/

Also - if you will be changing the location of that fabulous sink - it is super important to save every last bit of hardware, especially the drain flange. I acquired an antique wall hung kitchen sink, with all the parts. However - the cast iron flange for the drain was cracked. I had no clue about this until a plumber pointed it out. Even places like DEA Bath in California, that normally stock such parts for antique fixtures, did not have any, and did not know when they might get more. I lucked out and found one on Ebay - the ONLY one listed - that miraculously turned out to be the right size.

Here's a photo from the RR story of the sink dealer's own kitchen sink - one he paid $ 2000.00 for in St.Louis. And this guy knows sinks.

vintage-drainboard-kitchen-sinks-3-1.jpg
vintage-drainboard-kitchen-sinks-3-1.jpg (111.94 KiB) Viewed 466 times

1918ColonialRevival
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by 1918ColonialRevival »

If the sink has a jadeite finish, it's probably original. It looked blue in the picture, but it could be my monitor.

I believe Standard was the first to mass produce the sinks in different colors. There may have been some made earlier or by other manufacturers, but those were in small quantities or may have been custom orders. I just checked my 1925 Standard catalog and color finishes aren't listed yet. I can't get to my '27 catalog at the moment, but I'm 99.9% sure that was the first one to list finishes on kitchen and bath fixtures. I want to say Crane was right on their heels.

Speaking of which, several years back I was fortunate enough to salvage some items from a late '20s Mediterranean Revival house that was being demolished due to expansion of a medical center. Two of the bathrooms had the Standard fixtures in Orchid. I had no need for them, but knew someone who was looking for them so they were saved. The date on those fixtures was 1929, which seemed an accurate date for the house.

parkavenue79
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by parkavenue79 »

1918ColonialRevival wrote:Are you doing most of the work yourself? The reason I ask is pretty much everything I'm seeing can be saved. Some of it will take a little work. All too often, contractors will want to tear out original light fixtures, plumbing fixtures, wood trim, plaster, etc. Be selective with who you work with.

One final thing I wanted to mention was your door hardware. I forget the name of the design, but that particular door plate was in production throughout the 1910s and 1920s, so if you are missing any, they shouldn't be very tough to find and should be inexpensive.

By the way - I would have hit that dirt underneath the door with a metal detector. Many a coin has been lost by people digging for their keys. I've found quite a bit of silver and other interesting artifacts in similar areas around my house.


Actually, part of the reason it's taken me so long to start work on the house (I've owned it for a year) is that either no one would call me back, or they'd give me outrageous prices and want to tear everything down to the studs. I finally found a guy to help me do the work that thinks like I do, so we're going to do as little removal as possible.

The majority of my door hardware was stolen, along with the one mantel, before I bought the house. The only thing left on most of the doors are the cool locks - little turn-knobs located above the door plate.

The metal detector idea is a great one. We did find a dog collar/tag from 1957 when we ripped out the rotten porch.

parkavenue79
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by parkavenue79 »

1918ColonialRevival wrote:Also - forgot to mention, that tin ceiling should be saveable with some sanding and a couple of coats of good metal primer.

Regarding the sink in the basement. Standard (which merged with the American Radiator Company in 1929 to become the American-Standard that is still around today) introduced plumbing fixtures in various colors in 1927. I don't recognize this color as being one of their offerings around that period, so it may have been painted somewhere along the way. The color reminds me of the so-called "robin's egg blue" that was popular in the late 1950s. The styling of the sink is more 1910s-1930s. There may be a casting date on the bottom of the sink.

Kitchens in houses of this period were usually very small rooms that people other than the maid seldom ventured into. It also was somewhat common to have a second kitchen in the basement that was used for home canning or for special events that called for more cooking capacity than the main kitchen was able to accommodate. Our house had a second kitchen in the basement when we first bought it. We have pictures of both kitchens in full use when the previous owner's daughter was married in the house in 1954. There was also a small kitchen area in the finished attic, which was originally designed to be a maid's quarters. This would have been for the maid's personal use.


Thanks for the info on the sink and extra kitchen. To be honest I haven't looked to closely at the sink yet. The house doesn't have an electricity yet and there are a lot of spiders in the basement. And spiders are one of the few things that just creep me out. :lol:

As far as the tin ceiling....in the hallway of the basement a lot of it has unfortunately rusted away, or been cut out for plumbing. :crying-blue: :crying-green: But I think the back half of the hallway, plus the room with the sink can be saved.

parkavenue79
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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by parkavenue79 »

Willa wrote:There were colored kitchen sinks as far back as the early 20's. They were uncommon - which is why they are so desirable today. Here's a story about an antique sink dealer in Mass. There are several unusual early drainboard sinks in the photos, including an "orchid" one. I strongly doubt that the green sink in the house was painted or refinished, judging by the very original state of the house.

https://retrorenovation.com/2018/04/24/150-vintage-drainboard-kitchen-sinks-original-finish-in-stock-at-all-times-massachusetts-motherlode/

Also - if you will be changing the location of that fabulous sink - it is super important to save every last bit of hardware, especially the drain flange. I acquired an antique wall hung kitchen sink, with all the parts. However - the cast iron flange for the drain was cracked. I had no clue about this until a plumber pointed it out. Even places like DEA Bath in California, that normally stock such parts for antique fixtures, did not have any, and did not know when they might get more. I lucked out and found one on Ebay - the ONLY one listed - that miraculously turned out to be the right size.

Here's a photo from the RR story of the sink dealer's own kitchen sink - one he paid $ 2000.00 for in St.Louis. And this guy knows sinks.

vintage-drainboard-kitchen-sinks-3-1.jpg


Thanks for the info. I figured it was surely a special sink! I don't think I'm going to move it from it's spot, even as cool as that would be to have it in the current kitchen. I would be afraid that would just cause more problems and then I wouldn't have a cool sink in the basement!

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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by 1918ColonialRevival »

If the worst of the metal ceiling is in a hallway and is out of direct view of the rest of it, you could replace what's out there and keep the rest original. I highly recommend the metal ceiling products from W.F. Norman. Unlike a lot of the so-called decorator tin ceiling companies out there, Norman uses a thicker gauge metal and the designs are made using tooling they have had for a century. In fact, they still use their 1910 printed catalog to show their offerings - only the prices have been updated.

https://wfnorman.com/

If you go this route, attach the ceiling panels so that what is covering the plumbing can be easily removed should a repair need arise. One thing I can't stand to see is a plumber haphazardly cutting through whatever is in their way to get to a pipe.

Set off a few foggers the next time you are in there. That will take care of the spiders and just about any other bug that may be in there. I'd also recommend some agricultural rodent bait stations outside. You can get these from Tractor Supply or just about any farm supplier. We're getting to the time of year when the little varmints start scoping out places to bed down for the winter.

Looking at your pictures again, it looks like there was an animal skull under the porch as well?

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Re: Hi from Western KY!

Post by Gothichome »

Looking at your pictures again, it looks like there was an animal skull under the porch as well“
Well the mystery of the missing cat has been solved :lol:

Installing tin ceilings in a basement service room seems a bit odd, just a way of covering the grim of a working kitchen on the plaster ceiling?

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